Vir

Not related to L11, but to ASHO LA in 2004: http://forums.whyweprotest.net/123-l...e-318-a-32509/

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Jeff Stone | What is Dianetics? | I'm on Twitter and Brightkite as NorwAnon.

AnonLover

thanks for delicious dox pooks & kristi!
may yer 'puters always be healthy and your scanners alway scan brite!! :p

ONE DOES NOT SIMPLY SWORDS HIS WAY INTO THE CELEBRITY CENTRE
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DV8C

A few key sentences describing the L's, and key processing on L-11

(L&N is "Listing and Nulling, which a is a particular type of auditing process that involving addressing a list of items. See the link for the full list of items.)

Now here's my simplified explanation of L-11 auditing. I'm not a Class XI auditor, so productive corrections are welcome. I don't want to get real technical, but just want to give non exes a general idea of what happens in L-11 auditing.

The KEY point addressed and audited on L-11 is "Evil Purposes"

A large part of this auditing includes a list of words read by the auditor to the person on L-11 (the PC), and the PC has to give a response to each of the words.

Example:

Auditor says the following word from the list to the PC:
"Punish"

Then the PC responds with his reaction to the word:
"It would be necessary on a naughty child"

Auditor continues questioning, such as:
"Who or what would find it necessary to punish a naughty child?"

Auditor continues questioning the PC until the PC has a cognition and floating needle (i.e. feels good about the subject, no longer upset with the subject)

Then the auditor repeats the same process with the next word, which is "Avenge", and so on down the list.

When the entire list of items (words) is completed by the process above, and the PC feels good and has no more bad feelings or thoughts about anything on the list, the L-11 auditing is pretty much complete.

There are a few other things involved, such as having the PC read assorted technical bulletins, but the bulk of the auditing involves the process described above and also auditing the specific question "What Evil Purpose do you have?"

Exes, please don't jump all over me for any minor errors or not going into details, this is only meant to give a general idea to the uninitiated.

skidmark

So, is this how it would go with a random word off the list?

Auditor: Desecrate
Person: Something a grave robber would do to a grave. (or does it have to be "necessary"?)
Auditor asks questions about desecration to see what gives an emotional response until no response is given.

I can see this being really hard with "molest" or "sodomize."

From a therapy point of view - rationalizing and "coming to terms with" evil things is very damaging. Humans are supposed to have emotional responses to these terms - not make it so that they can picture the actions and have no negative response whatsoever.

It's like a severe form of people calling others faggot on this site. After a while, fag is a term of endearment instead of an insult. It's like necrophilia - imagining it is supposed to make you queasy - but we are so used to DW's internet persona that we just dismiss it as a quirk.

DV8C

Yes, you got the idea.

I don't have the reference, but L-11 specifically was designed for handling people with "psychotic breaks" (batshit crazy people). L-11 was later repackaged and promoted as expensive, "special" auditing done only at Flag, designed to unleash super duper OT powerz to people below OT VIII.

The entire focal point of L-11 is "What Evil Purpose do you have?” and then finding that Evil Purpose using the list of Evil Purpose words.

DV8C

Moose posted some great backgound info on L-11 here

Crazy Sword-Wielding Ex-Scilon Shot/Killed at Scientology Celebrity Center

Batman

ROBOTS!!!!
robots?

fucking priceless!

TADADADADADADADA BATMAN

skidmark

The first mistake in the logic (I know, that's kind of why we're here...) is that a person causes their own mental illnesses. Psychotic breaks don't just happen and they definitely aren't genetic or chosen - they are a human reaction to reoccurring trauma meant to allow the body to function without the rational brain.

I know a young girl with PTSD who reached an "anniversary" of trauma and went batshit insane. The anniversary affect is where a person who is hyper-vigilant notices a reoccurance of events and sees it as an inevitable omen towards being retraumatized. In the brain's effort to save itself, it starts releasing adrenaline and cortisol - both highten awareness and paranoia. And by batshit insane - I don't mean tantrums or destroying stuff or setting fires - I'm talking having to be restrained so they don't kill themselves or others. Imagine 'roid rage, then take away all conscience or fear.

The point of that story is that any "trigger" around an anniversary event has to be seriously taboo. If you add an external stressor on a patient already in crisis, you end up with Epic Swords Guy or a kid that kills everyone in the house. People who are already in crisis do crazy shit like poop in heating vents instead of the toilet (no kidding), try to control their surroundings to extremes, and self-medicate with drugs and alcohol. The worst part about it is they know the stuff they are doing is crazy, but they feel that if they stop they will be retraumatized.

To sane people, what that exercise does is take away the mental guards we all have. We don't touch stoves because it's hot.

Well say, someone took us in a room where there was only a stove but we didn't know it wasn't on. They made us touch it over and over again, slowly turning up the heat so we didn't notice how it was burning us immediately. After long enough, we would walk into our own home and touch a hot stove EXPECTING to not get burned because now we are special, right? Other people get burned because their mind thinks they'll get burned, right? We has invincible super powerz! When we get burned - oh. shit. Why did I get burned? What did I do wrong? It worked before! Why isn't it working now? I must have something wrong with me or someone is messing with my stove!

People are taught through childhood experiences to view things in a logical manner based on certain facts - fire is hot, don't touch it. When you remove that experience, you remove the logic that is founded on it. Very rarely does a person first question their beliefs - people are conditioned to examine themselves and their immediate surroundings first. If done with severe enough things, this can make people crazy.

A.Non Hubbard

Isn't that the same as assessment?

Who Is David Miscavige?

DV8C

I honestly don't remember the difference between assessment and Listing & Nulling.

It doesn't really matter in this context. All I was trying to do was give a brief overview of L-11 auditing in non-technical terms so non-scilons could get a basic idea.

Assessment and L&N are not the same. So send me to cramming.

AlphOhm

There is a point when you notice "there is no stove."

And you can make the illusion of the stove, be that illusion, be the body next to the stove and be the space/time illusion that it is all mocked up in...etc.




I am not sure that you will grasp this



yet.







Namaste,


AlphOhm

AlphOhm

No.

Assessment may be simply reading items from a prepared list, looking for areas to direct auditing to.







Namaste,

AlphOhm



PS here I gave a quick and dirty comparison earlier: Crazy Sword-Wielding Ex-Scilon Shot/Killed at Scientology Celebrity Center

AlphOhm

Oh...and "doll bodies" too!





Namaste,

AlphOhm

NijeDobro

Why yes, yes, it is. Thooouuuusssssaaaands of A.R.C.-broken and chopped up PCs couldn't be wrong.

Ideas, unlike men, are not all created equal.

DV8C

Only if you assume "the Tech" actually works.

Vir

Norway: AnonNorway Ning | Japan: JapanAnon, サイエントロジー | New comics site: Anon Comix
Jeff Stone | What is Dianetics? | I'm on Twitter and Brightkite as NorwAnon.

skidmark

I understand this idea on an intellectual level, but in the end it's just stupid. There IS a physical reality - we learn this around age 3 or 4 - that affects us and we can affect it. Standing next to a stove and saying to yourself "it's not real, it's not real, it's not real" doesn't affect reality while reaching over and turning the stove off and getting a potholder before you touch the hot pan DOES.

A weird but relevant view of this can be found in Naked Empire by Terry Goodkind. It's a fantasy novel, but it goes really deep into the actual thought process of these ideas.

moose

cults, scientology, hubbard, one of the top "scientologists" says... (Pierre Ethier) (wich can be found at many other places too) :
And here you can find what its all about:
Operation Clambake present: The L Rundown
basically, its just writing an essay within 1 day; and and we all know that can be extremely stressful that can be :P

____________________
I don't respect your beliefs and I don't care if you're offended.

NoMoreDiscoNnects

"I don't write fantasy novels. I write stories with important human themes." — Terry Goodkind, fantasy writer in denial

Sandstorm Reviews: The Goodkind Parodies

skidmark

The irony is amazing, isn't it?

I love Goodkind but the middle novels are oh so preachy.