Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Wisemanofthewatchtower, Dec 3, 2009.

  1. Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Hello anons.

    As of this post, I am moving out of my scientologist father's house, in preparation for an expected SP declare on me. I'll anwer your questions eventually, but I don't have internet access at my new place, so I will have to check this thread later at the library.

    I want to introduce myself and my involvement, so you will get an idea of what led me to be here. More importantly, because we've met before...


    I was in the Sea Org base in Toronto for two years (2007-2009). It is known as CLO Canada, and it is in charge of all Orgs and Missions(tiny orgs) in Canada. It is the top 4 floors of 696 yonge street, and below that is the CofS Toronto.

    I believed I could help many people when I joined the SO. So does everybody there. They want to help, and they really, really, really believe that they are achieving this. Nobody in the Toronto building intends to cheat people. I know this for sure. I don't know about the top management in LA.

    In July 2007, a set of books, called the "Basics" were re-released to be sold to all public Scientologists. The idea was that the older books had many errors due to rushed printing jobs, and were hard to understand.

    As time went on, it became clear to me that the sales of these books were more important than verifying if we had actually helped people. When managment communicates to public scientologists, they say that the biggest accomplishments are social reform (drug education, government reform, etc.) and acquiring new scientology churches (africa and Canada). Behind closed doors, the Sea Org's greatest accomplishment in the past two years was that Bridge publications broke the $300 million mark in sales. A movie night was held, with ice cream and chips and pop, and all was good.

    I didn't attend that movie night.

    You may not believe me that the Canadian SO are good at heart when they pull stuff like this, but they still are. Because they are middle management, a lot of their actions are determined by orders from the Int base, so that might be the source of this behaviour.

    In December 2008, I wanted to visit family for a week during Christmas. I was shocked to find out that a co-worker had not been home for christmas in 6 years. I agreed to stay and do his job so he could see family. Come January, I would ask twice for a week off, and both times, it was disapproved.

    I decided to go see my family anyway, as this kind of treatment was undeserved. I dedicated the entire past two years to working in CLO Canada, and it was bizzarre that they would try to prevent me from going.

    The night before my planned week off, I was confronted by to senior SO members, and threatened with shouts and warnings about being declared and never getting spiritually free, and that even if I left the building to go see my family, I wouldn't get to, because they would disconnect once the Declare was official.

    This use of MY RELIGION to control me an manipulate me was why I decided that things were not what they seemed. The canadian SO members who perpetrated this control activity were not entirely to blame: they were following orders from ILO and the Int base.

    I finally was dismissed in April 2009, three months after my "illegal" week off. I actually stopped being a scientologist way before I left the Sea Org, because of the pattern of threats used against me.

    I don't know how benificial auditing is. Evidence does suggest that people benefit from the lower grades, I believe. I never did any, and now I never will. But if this stuff actually works, then the manipulation perpetrated by management is even worse, because they are creating their own enemies by the way they treat their staff, and they are preventing people from wanting to do the services with their brazen high-pressure book sales campaigns.

    -Wiseman of the Watchtower
    (more to come)
  2. Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

  3. _You_ Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Welcome aboard :)

    Are the rumors of people actually being berthed in that building true?
  4. Ann O'Nymous Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Watchtower: Not very wise to use the name of another cult in your nickname. Just saying.

    Having said that, welcome on board.
  5. webkilla Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    congratulations on leaving the sea org - your tale is similar to many others who have left

    i do have some questions though

    1) do you still consider Co$ tech the basis of this 'religion' you mention? or have you completely given up all things scientology and moved on?

    2) you speak of a pattern of threats - would you say that you have been Fair Gamed? kindly give us specific examples if so (we like to speak of these when warning others of Fair Game practices)

    either way - congrats on leaving the Co$
  6. xenubarb Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    There's a cult named Watchtower? Or are you thinking of those silly booklets the JWs leave on my porch?
  7. Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    LOL. Fail.
  8. Hombre Moderator Skandinaviska

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    I'm happy you're out of the Sea Org and hope you'll get on living your life the way you want.

    If you haven't heard, there's a criminal investigation of Scientology taking place in Australia. If you want to help out, please send your story detailing the threats and intimidation you were subjected to and any illegal/unethical treatment of the Sea Org to Senator Xenuphon:
  9. xenubarb Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    In a past life??? Just kidding! Welcome to the fray. Are you a 2nd generation Scientologist?

    You might not know it, but many of us are aware that good, well-meaning people can get slurped up into Scientology without ever being aware that they are actually targeted by the cult. A lot of people correctly view most members as victims of Scientology, not perpetrators of crimes. OSA excepted, of course. We know who the criminals are.

    Any time someone with problems has an opportunity to talk to a seemingly caring individual, it can help them sort things out. However, it's not a concept original to Hubbard, and in Scientology, what's good isn't original, and what's original isn't good. (to steal a phrase)

    Anyway, welcome. Did you know a Peter Ramsay while you were at Toronto?
  10. anonsparrow Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Welcome Wiseman! Looking forward to hearing moar!
  11. Anon323565898 Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Wow, thank you for that statement Wiseman. Welcome aboard.
  12. sheeple Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto


    Do you know appx how many SO members there are in Toronto? In Canada?
  13. N. Ron Rubber Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Welcome aboard, WotW.
  14. TehHerro Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    welcome to the board, and please, do not take offense if we bicker amongst ourselves, that is just our natural dysfunction, its great for the creative process!

    anyway, if they keep harassing you, just tell us and I promise you, we will make it stop, we have contacts in the police, lawyers, and the media, plus its rather embrassing if we show up at their doorstep with signs saying "Why are you harassing so and so?"
  15. _You_ Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    If on second thought you think we are too rude, I advice to sign up for an account on Ex Scientologist Message Board , Ex-Scientology Kids or another forum.
  16. _You_ Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    WOTW, congratulations are in order for you having stood up for yourself and what was right. But, having to move out of your home... man, that sucks. I'm sorry this is happening.
  17. HellRazor Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Welcome (again) OP.

  18. _You_ Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Fuck off Ann. No one here has ever cared about what you're "just saying".

    What an arrogant way for you to greet a blown scientologist. You've been a certified dipshit for months now but this REALLY takes the fucking caek.
  19. Anon1720 Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Hello again Wiseman.

    Hope you have good people in your life to help you out during this time. If you do get an SP declare do you think your father will disconnect from you? Not all people do even though they are ordered to do so. I hope for your sake that he wakes up.

    Do you have any information about Marc Headley's sister?

    So, the Toronto SO must be pretty happy that TO Anons aren't out there protesting very much these days but they must not think that we aren't keeping an eye on things.

    Keep in touch when you can.
  20. Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Hey Wiseman!
    Good for you and keep strong, bro. There are lots of resources in Toronto area to help you should you need it. Especially if you say you have blown the cult. Stay strong and keep on telling your story.
  21. kamakaze2000 Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

  22. _You_ Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Can you tell us anything moar about the new CLO/Advanced Org in Mono, Ontario?
  23. WTF Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Welcome !

    Caution: this is not that much of a "support" area. Any insults you may receive probably should be ignored, badgering others is pretty much a way of expressing affinity here.

    I agree on the intentions to "help" being strong for many staff who do not see the Int. mgmt. intentions or actions. Saving mankind is a huge purpose after all.

    Best wishes with your new found freedom.
  24. _You_ Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    This ^ is actually a more important questions that it sounds like. Please answer it:)

    Glad you are out , it keeps our stats up! j/k :)

    Don't let the people here scare you off saying that we get insulting. Once you get use to us we are pretty harmless. We just have some strange ways of doing things as you probably have already seen.

    No matter if you decide to stay or not thanks for letting us know you are out. We would love reports from inside !
  25. _You_ Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    So an SO member blows and seeks to help Anonymous Toronto in taking down the cult[ish aspects of Scientology].

    if anyone can fuck up this opportunity, it's Anonymous Toronto.
  26. RightOn Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Way To go. Glad your out.
    It can't be easy.
    Continued luck and success with starting your life over.
    Enjoy your freedom.
  27. JohnnyRUClear Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Gee, this touching story sounds very plausible. I say we accept it uncritically. WHO'S WITH ME??
  28. iaxiloll Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    is it me you're looking for?

    I can see it in your eyes
    I can see it in your smile
    You're all I've ever wanted, (and) my arms are open wide
    'Cause you know just what to say
    And you know just what to do
    And I want to tell you so much, I love you ...

    I long to see the sunlight in your hair
    And tell you time and time again how much I care
    Sometimes I feel my heart will overflow
    Hello, I've just got to let you know

    'Cause I wonder where you are
    And I wonder what you do
    Are you somewhere feeling lonely, or is someone loving you?
    Tell me how to win your heart
    For I haven't got a clue
    But let me start by saying, I love you ...

    Hello, is it me you're looking for?
    'Cause I wonder where you are
    And I wonder what you do
    Are you somewhere feeling lonely or is someone loving you?
    Tell me how to win your heart
    For I haven't got a clue
    But let me start by saying ... I love you
  29. MarlieK Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Congratulations on getting out.

    I didn't know there was a SeaOrg base in Toronto. How many SeaOrgers are in Toronto?
  30. _You_ Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Toronto is the headquarters (CLO, or Continental Liason Office) of the CoS crime syndicate in Canada.

    Scientology is run by the Sea Org and the CMO.
  31. _You_ Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    You should meet with the RCMP and tell them what you know. Stuff is going on, and if more people talk, the better.
  32. RightOn Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    I'm right here Lionel!
  33. Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    300m in sales since its inception, or 300m in sales in the last two years?

    Do you know anything about how the church or even your org is doing financially these days? How many fully committed people do you have up there? how many are leaving?
  34. afternon Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    @ Ilovetheleader- ROFL at your avatar!
  35. YAHRLY Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    dear OP dox or GTFO
  36. Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Part II of my intro

    The Attack of Anonymous

    It was around 9pm in february. I was minding my own business, filing some papers in the basement files room. All of a sudden one of my Sea Org seniors comes to get me. She says that there is a 'situation' and we were going to have an emergency meeting before shutting down for the night.

    As all the sea org members stood silently, with a tense apprehension of the news to come, someone called 'attention' and we waited.

    The Commanding officer of the CLO greeted all the Sea Org base, and the first thing he said was "Now LRH says that when you expand, you find SPs will get mad" He went on to describe that a group called 'anonymous,' which attacks many religions and other good groups, had turned their attention on the scientology building this time.

    He said there were plans of vandalism, and other such things. I was particularly concerned about the vandalism. There were also fears of Sea Org members being assaulted as they went home, and the SO members were broken into groups, to walk home safely.

    Following that briefing, most were allowed to carry on, but the big guys (including me) were held back for a special 'planning' stage. We hear further details about the pranks, which were pretty low. They said there was a plan to 'shit bomb' the sewer system to create a flood inside the building.

    Following that, we were given different jobs. I became the night security guard, along with one other man. It began immediately. Because I had no post at the time, I would spend over a month on the night shift, watching constantly for vandalism.

    The day of the first protest came, and I was finishing my night shift and heading to sleep. Because of my schedule, I never saw any of the protests.

    Interestingly, while anons never did anything, they inspired some stupid stuff done by random people. It wasn't much more than some eggs and spat-on windows, but I was really pissed that I had to scrape frozen egg off a window at 3am on february. Not fun.

    One night, people across the street were throwing snowballs at the org. I went over to one man and confronted him. He was drunk. He said that he didn't like the sign. I said that he doesn't have to like scientology but he shouldn't throw stuff at the building. I said "if I don't like you, I wouldn't throw stuff at your house." That was pretty much it.

    Prank Calls

    The biggest "attack" that we got in toronto were prank calls to the 1st floor reception. I actually didn't mind the calls - when you get a real call from another scientology org, it is actually more frustrating then any prank call I ever received, because it meant running around the building to find somebody. And boy are they persistent - I once had to hang up on a Flag saleswoman because she was harassing one of our staff to buy a Basics package off her account!

    Then one day I got a 'nice' prank call with a recorded message that 'anonymous is here to help'

    Yeah, right. After all the crap I went through, the last thing I would do is approach anonymous.

    So that was my experience with you on the other side. Which is why I strongly believe that pranks are no good: nothing is more effective at keeping SO members glued together then a prominent (and rude) enemy.


    My intention is to reform management. I now see that you are aware of the same problems I am. You just have a lot to learn.

    Properly done, you can make a positive difference.

    I can provide the wisdom, but it is up to you to use it.

    -Wiseman of the Watchtower
  37. _You_ Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    If I'm not mistaken, this is our FIRST actual testimonial from an ex-staff member who was in during the Anonymous protests. Wow. Tell us more!

    What were the opinions of your fellow staffers? Did you ever see any of the protests at all? Do you know who "spacko" is? What did you think at the time? Did they always react to the protesters in a big way? Did they have pictures of the protesters inside the org or anything? Did you really eat rice and beans? What were your living quarters like?

    Any other information would be massively helpful.
  38. Random guy Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    The general consensus around is that upper management (i.e. Miscavige) can not be changed. I think you'll find that no-one here doubt your intentions, nor your sincerity, but the feasibility is something else. Miscavige in particular will face a criminal charge when CoS falls, and so will probably quite a few of his henchmen. As of now, they are living in splendor on the insane hard sell to the public scientologists and the virtual slave labour of the sea org. I guess you can see that any sort of reform will not happen with the current management in place.
  39. _You_ Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Have you witnessed any abuses while you were in the toronto sea org? I've hard that the canadian RPF is the worst in the world. Any info on that?
  40. Ogsonofgroo Member

    Re: Intro from Ex-SO member, Toronto

    Some proof of all the 'charity' actions, (lets see where it actually goes guys), would be a nice scamble of fail for cult.
    Come on, cult is, as we know, not anything resembling a charity. Time for our respective govt's to call them on it.
    Lets see the proof CoS, reciepts, statements from the recipients, etc., where are they?

    Oh we know. So will everyone pretty darned soon.


    Rock on Anons!

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